• Havoc
  • Caius
  • redboot
  • Rules
  • Chain of Command
  • Members
  • Supported Ladders & Games
  • Downloads


New Kharkov '43 Campaign
08-08-2020, 11:01 AM, (This post was last modified: 08-08-2020, 11:03 AM by ComradeP.)
#11
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
That's the same thing I mentioned, the quality fire modifier only applies to positive (A/B quality) percentage modifiers.

Considering the small size of the Soviet battalions, I would suggest testing it with C quality Rifle formations first.

They'll need to pass a lot of Disruption checks to maintain any sort of combat capability, as the small battalion size means more numerous Disruption checks when taking losses.

Increased German firepower combined with decreased Soviet cohesion would quickly make the game difficult to impossible for the Soviets.

Other suggestions:

Increase Clear movement cost to 8 to prevent 2 hex movement for A quality Deployed German infantry. The 2 hex movement is a big deal, and has a significant impact on scenario balance. Removing it would require the German player to think plan moves more carefully and would make it more difficult to redeploy non-mechanized units quickly. C quality infantry can still move from Clear hex to Clear hex and fire when the cost is 8, provided there's no elevation increase between the hexes.

Decrease Improved Position/Trench values to 10/20 instead of 20/40. Considering the season the campaign takes place in, trenches in Clear terrain provide a substantial benefit whereas the fighting was historically focussed on towns/villages.

The various terrain, quality fire and fortification modifiers are also cumulative, which means that with a -40% Trench value Entrenched units in City hexes are bulletproof when fired at by D quality units (40 Trench+40 City+20 D quality penalty=100% reduction).
Quote this message in a reply
08-08-2020, 11:34 AM, (This post was last modified: 08-08-2020, 11:37 AM by BigDuke66.)
#12
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
Don't think that's a bug, manual says:
"...that applies to fire modifiers for A and B units below."
That is slightly misleading if you think it would mean "A and B and below" so also for all other qualities, but it only refers to the list below were every quality has a percentage assigned. Removing this "below" would make that clear.

Besides that I think the QFM needs a serious check. I looked at the stock PDT and it has it at 1, but the PDT for the variant has it a zero(That is from 1.04 Gold). Math class was long ago but zero times something is still zero afaik.
Can it be that such strong settings are considered for the QFM because of feedback from games with that zero QFM?
Quote this message in a reply
08-08-2020, 04:38 PM,
#13
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
The majority of the scenarios in Kharkov '43 still use the original PDT, with amongst other things 5 Speed Deployed infantry units and a QFM of 1.

Though the extra 20% or 30% firepower is helpful when the QFM is increased to 2 or 2.5 (Panzer Battles), the biggest benefit in my opinion is that it cancels out terrain/fortification fire value penalties by adding/subtracting the numbers instead of applying the percentage modifiers in sequence.
Quote this message in a reply
08-09-2020, 07:28 AM,
#14
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
Sure but if the coming Variant 2 is an improved Variant 1 then the question stays if what is with the QFM of zero in V1 and does it really need a 2 or even 2.5 in V2.
Quote this message in a reply
08-09-2020, 07:19 PM,
#15
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
(08-08-2020, 11:34 AM)BigDuke66 Wrote: Don't think that's a bug, manual says:
"...that applies to fire modifiers for A and B units below."
That is slightly misleading if you think it would mean "A and B and below" so also for all other qualities, but it only refers to the list below were every quality has a percentage assigned. Removing this "below" would make that clear.

Besides that I think the QFM needs a serious check. I looked at the stock PDT and it has it at 1, but the PDT for the variant has it a zero(That is from 1.04 Gold). Math class was long ago but zero times something is still zero afaik.
Can it be that such strong settings are considered for the QFM because of feedback from games with that zero QFM?

Hi,

This is a good find.

The (inadvertent) 0 value in the Variant 1 PDT file for the QFM has the impact of completely removing the modifier for A & B units.

That was never intended and will be corrected in the next patch cycle. With all the other scenarios set as a QFM of 1, there is no impact. Please note this isn't a bug, just another way that the QFM values can be adjusted.

We are having discussions on what if anything to do with QFM in Variant 2.

Let me be clear. Variant 2 is not an adjusted Variant 1. It is a completely new version of the campaign, primarily created by Cesar. To complicate matters further, we will probably release an interim version that works with the current game build so people can test it out, but that will be without time limited objectives. The primary release will come out with the next patch where new enhancements such time limited objectives is available.

That said, we want to get the interim version out ASAP so you can all try it out and give us your thoughts on the included changes.

Thanks,

David
Quote this message in a reply
08-10-2020, 07:55 PM,
#16
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
Hi Everyone,

We have now done the first version of the 'interim' Variant 2 scenario. This should work with 1.04 Gold version of Kharkov '43. The download link is in the the first post of this thread.

The notes have also been updated. This interim version has been adapted to not use Limited VP Objectives and is only a temporary version until the latest patch adds those into the game. We would like for people to look at the rest of the situation and changes made so we can stress test these updates. Please feel free to comment as necessary in this thread. I expect Cesar will be available to comment or clarify on anything you observe.

thanks,

David
Quote this message in a reply
08-10-2020, 08:06 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-10-2020, 08:07 PM by Indragnir.)
#17
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
Notice the victory conditions link is for LVP.
The No LVP uses only the russian value for VP locations and there is a bonus or malus point in every phase.

Check the table attached.


Attached Files
.pdf   Kharkov 43 v2.0 NoLVP Victory Chart.pdf (Size: 52.52 KB / Downloads: 13)
Quote this message in a reply
08-17-2020, 02:28 PM,
#18
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
Is there any meaning to the equipment having a v at the end?
Like in:
- 20mm Flak (mot) v
- 150mm IG SP v
- 75mm AT (mot) v
etc.
Quote this message in a reply
08-17-2020, 04:00 PM,
#19
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
(08-17-2020, 02:28 PM)BigDuke66 Wrote: Is there any meaning to the equipment having a v at the end?
Like in:
- 20mm Flak (mot) v
- 150mm IG SP v
- 75mm AT (mot) v
etc.

Yes,

"v" units have altered values from Variant_1, since there are other scenarios under variant_1 and grand campaign we wanted to keep them seperated in case those new values would alter somehow the balance of other scenarios.
Same art but different values.
Quote this message in a reply
08-24-2020, 04:40 PM,
#20
RE: New Kharkov '43 Campaign
Different values OK, in that case I'm unsure if to report this.
Notes list StuG.Abt.228 as:
-StuG.Abt.228 had 17 StuG, 9 StuG IIIg and 8 StuG IIIe
Now that explains the different graphics but why are the values similar? When graphics & notes describe a long & a short barrel version one usually expects different values, especially that the short barrel version has a lot less hard attack value.
Afaik StuG IIIe should use 7.5-cm-StuK 37 L/24 while StuG IIIg 7.5 cm StuK 40 L/48.
Quote this message in a reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)