• Havoc
  • Caius
  • redboot
  • Rules
  • Chain of Command
  • Members
  • Supported Ladders & Games
  • Downloads


Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Question for experienced players
11-05-2017, 01:32 AM,
#11
RE: Question for experienced players
(11-04-2017, 11:23 AM)Weasel Wrote: I only realized last turn before the screen shots above that my units adjacent to the enemy will not upgrade their equipment or will do so slowly while withdrawn and set to refit will do it much quicker.  I had noticed that a bunch of my units were still using T60s instead of T70s.

The refit system has received many changes, but to my knowledge this part of 18.3. Refit Mode still applies.

18.3. Refit Mode - All ground units in refit mode will have the first opportunity to receive replacements during the refit sub-segment. Refit mode allows the player to set up two groups of units, those that will receive replacements first, and those that will receive replacements only after those in the refit group have received as much as they can get given their distance from the nearest railhead. Units in refit mode are normally the only units to receive upgraded equipment, unless the pool of older equipment runs out, at which point units without refit enabled would upgrade if there is newer equipment available.

With the A & B refit system, two groups of units are prioritized over normal replacements. From the What's new PDF.

V1.08.00 – October 21, 2014 New features 1. Reworked ground element upgrade, swap and replacement formulas (including training, sending back damaged or excess elements, converting support squads and adjusting morale and experience) from the ground up. It should result in better utilization of ground pools and choosing better models on upgrade or swap, prioritizing units in the rear over those on the front. Also, it should prevent units on the front from being starved of replacements, by reserving part of manpower, armaments and equipment pools for their use. Refit replacement segment was split into two parts, A and B. In part A only combat units on refit and support units attached to them get replacements. They have a chance to use more manpower, armaments and equipment than their numbers suggest. In part B the units that are considered to be always on refit (like HQs with support units attached to them, airbases and rail construction units) get replacements. This allows the player to better control the units that get replacements, where previously most of the available manpower was used on keeping the HQs up to strength, while combat units were sucked dry. The logistics phase log now gives a much better overview of replacements process.

You have two group always receiving the new equipment and one of those groups (support units) you cannot turn on and off. This is why it is important to rotate armies from time to time out of combat to refit. With the exception of 1941, I have three Soviet Armies in a Front. 3 in combat and one in reserve on refit mode.

Pro Tip: A Soviet Army has a Command Capacity of 18. A Soviet Front has a Command Capacity of 72 allowing 4 Armies. It is effective in 4/42 after the first Blizzard and is the basis of your Soviet force structure. Organizing your force around this structure can help you Commander, manage your refit and replacement system. 3 fighting, 1 resting. 

In addition, the following rule is no longer in effect to minimize player management. 18.2.2. Ground Element Replacements and TOE limited Soviet and Axis Infantry TOEs to 60% and 80% respectively. This was rescinded in V1.08.01 – December 5, 2014, Item #1. Which added another demand to the replacement pool, but reduced the burden on the player to rotate so many units in lieu of the historical outcome, to raise the TOE above this limitation.

Pro Tip: Setting units to refit at least 10 hexes from enemy units on an active rail line will give you the maximum benefit of receiving replacements, moral, experience, and equipment upgrades in the shortest amount of time.

Another excellent point. Keeping a reserve and rotating units out to upgrade and maintain you units is essential for any warfighting effort.

- Gris
'Millions died or suffered in the mud of Flanders between 1914-18. Who remembers them? Even those with names on their graves are by now unknown soldiers.' - Mier Ronnen, Jerusalem Post, 1933 Gris
Quote this message in a reply
11-05-2017, 04:43 AM,
#12
RE: Question for experienced players
Yeah, this was the part I was referring too:

"prioritizing units in the rear over those on the front"
Some of us are busy doing things; some of us are busy complaining - Debasish Mridha
Quote this message in a reply
11-08-2017, 02:20 PM, (This post was last modified: 11-08-2017, 02:26 PM by Weasel.)
#13
RE: Question for experienced players
(11-03-2017, 05:55 AM)Gris Wrote:
(10-30-2017, 03:35 AM)Weasel Wrote: I am at mid November 1942 and I was wondering what aircraft levels experienced players aim for, if any, and which support units they tend to buy and which they ignore.

My aircraft levels are at 7348, of which:  3200 are fighter/FB; 950 are tactical bombers, and; 3100 are bombers/recon/NF/transport.  Should I be increasing or decreasing any amounts?  I think transports need more, only have 173 of them (I just disbanded a bunch of U2 ones).

As for support units what are the main ones you go for?  I seem to be mostly building army artillery, sappers, flame companies and construction units.  Mortars, rockets and tank battalions are little used, is that good or bad?  I have yet to build a support AAA battalion, are they really needed?

Thanks for any feedback.

**Oh, what the hell do I do with air army HQ?**

For Air Army Hq, pretty much the same as other HQs. You can only assign AA support units (I assign at least 2 AA Bn), and keep them in range of units (although supply is different for them). Probably the most important function you can perform is assign a really good Leader. Leaders influence many of the action your air units perform.

Support and Aircraft preferences seem to vary from player to player. In the beginning many players disbanded the Motorcycle units for the trucks, but they also have a high CV. Oddly enough, last time I check, they had no recon value, which you would think otherwise. I use a lot of artillery and mortars. I like to hit the enemy in all range bands. I use motorcycle units at Front HQ (although they don't always join combats, never dug into why). Flame units are just cool. The difficulty I have and one of the reasons I don't dig into it too much is every patch the device list changes (huge list) and it has an effect. So are Motorcycle Regiments good? Maybe if the Motorcycle "devices" are. I think you have three player camps in both areas. 

1. Players build whatever, randomly, when they remember to. This was me in the beginning.

2. Min/max. Digs into the numbers and builds the most effective units. I have too many games going on to invest the time in this one.

3. Historical perception (my version of history, which may be "accurate"). I fall in this camp. I like to make the 5th Guards Tanks Army just like the Soviets did.

So if you are new and want an idea how to do this, here is one way without researching Tables of Organizations. (Although researching TO&E is great fun! Just sayin')

Open up the Campaign game 1944 -45 and find the 5th GTA (hex 86,51). Here is the Support units attached.

[Image: 5GTA.jpg]

If your not sure what to build, here is what the Soviets did and it worked for them. It is a good start. You can use this for airbases too. The 1st Air Army had 15 airbases with 2-4 air groups per base. The Soviets have 328 air groups. 142 Fighters/FB, 124 Tac, and the rest. You can look at the campaign in each year to get an idea of where your historical counterpart was. You can look at Soviets Corps too and see what are attached to them.

[Image: 36th%20Corps.jpg]

You can see the units in the bottom right. It also is a great reference for experience, morale, and CV comparisons. 

I like to lean towards artillery at all ranges. For Aircraft, 1/2 fighters, 1/4+ Tac, 1/4- everything else. I will compensate too. If I am short on transports, I will build IL-4s if I have more of them, until I get the transports up to speed. They have great range and if you set them to night on a VSS airbases they can help supply partisans. If I have an abundance of T-34's. I will build separate tank BN. 

I wish I could post a snapshot from my current game, but it is on the server. It would be interesting to see some of the ideal builds by other players on the ladder.

Weasel,  It would be interesting to see what you have attached to one of your Corps and the CVs vs the 36th.

Myself, I lean towards history (as related in WITE and my own grandiose perception) and based on what I have logistically. 

Except for flame units. They are just too cool to pass up. See you on the Steppe.

- Gris.

I just read this again and it sunk in that you are saying at campaign start all HQs/Corps etc are historically stocked as per their real life counter part?  If so, well first off HOLY CRAP, talk about a ton of research by GG and secondly that is excellent information. I do have a standard buy now, for infantry I like sapper regiment, FT company and MG-Art btn; for tanks l like sapper regiment, tank FT company and heavy tank regiment, and for cav I like sapper regiment, FT company and a TD btn.

I am finding my biggest problem with my attack right now is that fatigue is heavy but I don't want to waste a week rotating units around and letting the enemy reform their lines so I am grinding them out. I have fresh armies behind that are moving up and now that I have punched a 30 mile gap in the lines with no enemy in sight in the south I should be able to rotate. Blizzard isn't helping.
Some of us are busy doing things; some of us are busy complaining - Debasish Mridha
Quote this message in a reply
11-08-2017, 03:35 PM,
#14
RE: Question for experienced players
(11-08-2017, 02:20 PM)Weasel Wrote:
(11-03-2017, 05:55 AM)Gris Wrote:
(10-30-2017, 03:35 AM)Weasel Wrote: I am at mid November 1942 and I was wondering what aircraft levels experienced players aim for, if any, and which support units they tend to buy and which they ignore.

My aircraft levels are at 7348, of which:  3200 are fighter/FB; 950 are tactical bombers, and; 3100 are bombers/recon/NF/transport.  Should I be increasing or decreasing any amounts?  I think transports need more, only have 173 of them (I just disbanded a bunch of U2 ones).

As for support units what are the main ones you go for?  I seem to be mostly building army artillery, sappers, flame companies and construction units.  Mortars, rockets and tank battalions are little used, is that good or bad?  I have yet to build a support AAA battalion, are they really needed?

Thanks for any feedback.

**Oh, what the hell do I do with air army HQ?**

For Air Army Hq, pretty much the same as other HQs. You can only assign AA support units (I assign at least 2 AA Bn), and keep them in range of units (although supply is different for them). Probably the most important function you can perform is assign a really good Leader. Leaders influence many of the action your air units perform.

Support and Aircraft preferences seem to vary from player to player. In the beginning many players disbanded the Motorcycle units for the trucks, but they also have a high CV. Oddly enough, last time I check, they had no recon value, which you would think otherwise. I use a lot of artillery and mortars. I like to hit the enemy in all range bands. I use motorcycle units at Front HQ (although they don't always join combats, never dug into why). Flame units are just cool. The difficulty I have and one of the reasons I don't dig into it too much is every patch the device list changes (huge list) and it has an effect. So are Motorcycle Regiments good? Maybe if the Motorcycle "devices" are. I think you have three player camps in both areas. 

1. Players build whatever, randomly, when they remember to. This was me in the beginning.

2. Min/max. Digs into the numbers and builds the most effective units. I have too many games going on to invest the time in this one.

3. Historical perception (my version of history, which may be "accurate"). I fall in this camp. I like to make the 5th Guards Tanks Army just like the Soviets did.

So if you are new and want an idea how to do this, here is one way without researching Tables of Organizations. (Although researching TO&E is great fun! Just sayin')

Open up the Campaign game 1944 -45 and find the 5th GTA (hex 86,51). Here is the Support units attached.

[Image: 5GTA.jpg]

If your not sure what to build, here is what the Soviets did and it worked for them. It is a good start. You can use this for airbases too. The 1st Air Army had 15 airbases with 2-4 air groups per base. The Soviets have 328 air groups. 142 Fighters/FB, 124 Tac, and the rest. You can look at the campaign in each year to get an idea of where your historical counterpart was. You can look at Soviets Corps too and see what are attached to them.

[Image: 36th%20Corps.jpg]

You can see the units in the bottom right. It also is a great reference for experience, morale, and CV comparisons. 

I like to lean towards artillery at all ranges. For Aircraft, 1/2 fighters, 1/4+ Tac, 1/4- everything else. I will compensate too. If I am short on transports, I will build IL-4s if I have more of them, until I get the transports up to speed. They have great range and if you set them to night on a VSS airbases they can help supply partisans. If I have an abundance of T-34's. I will build separate tank BN. 

I wish I could post a snapshot from my current game, but it is on the server. It would be interesting to see some of the ideal builds by other players on the ladder.

Weasel,  It would be interesting to see what you have attached to one of your Corps and the CVs vs the 36th.

Myself, I lean towards history (as related in WITE and my own grandiose perception) and based on what I have logistically. 

Except for flame units. They are just too cool to pass up. See you on the Steppe.

- Gris.

I just read this again and it sunk in that you are saying at campaign start all HQs/Corps etc are historically stocked as per their real life counter part?  If so, well first off HOLY CRAP, talk about a ton of research by GG and secondly that is excellent information.  I do have a standard buy now, for infantry I like sapper regiment, FT company and MG-Art btn; for tanks l like sapper regiment, tank FT company and heavy tank regiment, and for cav I like sapper regiment, FT company and a TD btn.

I am finding my biggest problem with my attack right now is that fatigue is heavy but I don't want to waste a week rotating units around and letting the enemy reform their lines so I am grinding them out.  I have fresh armies behind that are moving up and now that I have punched a 30 mile gap in the lines with no enemy in sight in the south I should be able to rotate.  Blizzard isn't helping.

Reading various parts of the what's new pdf, it seems all the scenarios receive updates for unit composition, and based on the many post on the matrix forums, I would say it is an acceptable representation. Like any game, book, or media, it is open to interpretation, but I feel it gets the job done:) My perception and given Mr Grigsby and team's reputation, I believe it to be so. We could check it if we wanted too, but it is difficult to know why something was done if it does not match our sources, like game balance for example. The Sapper discussion and change in 1.11 patch was one of the most recent changes based on history for example. Air dropping fuel is another. The device lists in the patches are a huge amount of research. I agree, quite a task!

I use the method  (looking at campaigns) quite a bit to put support templates together and has worked well for me. I also use them to check my rate of advance  (or retreat) when playing HTH. I always like to stress too, it is a good starting point. With the experience you have gained, your support package looks like something I would want to use.
 
Flame tanks, my friend, flame tanks  Big Grin

The golden rule for fatigue, if it has not changed under the hood, is 30 fatigue points is a drop of 10%CV. That is a big hit, especially for the Soviets in 44. As you know, sometimes you have no choice. My guess, if you are heading for Berlin, you will probably outrun your rail line before fatigue shuts you down. Which was a big problem for the Soviets. Supply stopped Bagration, not the Axis. 

In WITE, like many other stats, they are indications for the Commander to assist in making a decision. Do I keep pushing my men or do I pull them out of line. Ready, Refit, or Reserve are decisions inputted by the player based on feedback in the interface and the desire to have a unit perform a certain action. I really enjoy this part of the game. It is all logistics really. Just as your selection of support units. Well done.

I would too, keep the pressure on, and feed more units through that gap.

"so I am grinding them out"

That's how you Soviet Steam Roll like a Commissar!   Whip

- Gris
'Millions died or suffered in the mud of Flanders between 1914-18. Who remembers them? Even those with names on their graves are by now unknown soldiers.' - Mier Ronnen, Jerusalem Post, 1933 Gris
Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2017, 12:08 PM,
#15
Breakthrough!
As you can see I have several large holes in the enemy lines with nothing behind them; at the very least the Germans are going to have to pull troops from the Smolensk area which will enable those units to push through, but I think Romania is finished in this one.  This is why I don't want to rest the units, but next turn is mud if I remember correctly so they will get a bit of a break.

[Image: breakout.jpg]
Some of us are busy doing things; some of us are busy complaining - Debasish Mridha
Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2017, 02:34 PM,
#16
RE: Breakthrough!
(11-09-2017, 12:08 PM)Weasel Wrote: As you can see I have several large holes in the enemy lines with nothing behind them; at the very least the Germans are going to have to pull troops from the Smolensk area which will enable those units to push through, but I think Romania is finished in this one.  This is why I don't want to rest the units, but next turn is mud if I remember correctly so they will get a bit of a break.

[Image: breakout.jpg]

Mud will be the only thing stopping you. I like how you setup lanes. I use lanes starting with the blizzard. Romania is done for.
'Millions died or suffered in the mud of Flanders between 1914-18. Who remembers them? Even those with names on their graves are by now unknown soldiers.' - Mier Ronnen, Jerusalem Post, 1933 Gris
Quote this message in a reply
11-10-2017, 07:35 AM,
#17
RE: Question for experienced players
Germans did a mass relocation on the turn after this screen shot. The Leningrad front has been withdrawn to Ptskov (?) and Smolensk has been thinned out to a degree. Suddenly 4 Pz div showed up in the south this turn that were not there before...cheating AI. Still not enough to stop the horde with 20 reserve divisions moving into the south from the Crimea and another 12 from Moscow.
Some of us are busy doing things; some of us are busy complaining - Debasish Mridha
Quote this message in a reply
11-10-2017, 07:52 AM,
#18
RE: Question for experienced players
(11-10-2017, 07:35 AM)Weasel Wrote: Germans did a mass relocation on the turn after this screen shot.  The Leningrad front has been withdrawn to Ptskov (?) and Smolensk has been thinned out to a degree.  Suddenly 4 Pz div showed up in the south this turn that were not there before...cheating AI.  Still not enough to stop the horde with 20 reserve divisions moving into the south from the Crimea and another 12 from Moscow.

Right on. You'll have to post some screens of the fall of Romania.
'Millions died or suffered in the mud of Flanders between 1914-18. Who remembers them? Even those with names on their graves are by now unknown soldiers.' - Mier Ronnen, Jerusalem Post, 1933 Gris
Quote this message in a reply
11-10-2017, 02:14 PM,
#19
RE: Question for experienced players
They have now moved all but 4 Pz Div to the south, so I am facing about 12 Pz in the south which is ok by me as now the north is starting to roll forward as is my attack in the marshes. Once the pressure builds enough in the north I expect the Pz units will move up there again.

Right now I am resting my corps, they are pretty tired at 50-60 fatigue.

Playing as Germany will seem rather boring after this.
Some of us are busy doing things; some of us are busy complaining - Debasish Mridha
Quote this message in a reply
11-11-2017, 02:56 PM,
#20
RE: Question for experienced players
Reminds me of the destruction of AGC in 1944, after the Germans moved most of their mobile troops south!
[Image: exercise.png]
Quote this message in a reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)